Collaboration effort

[EL34]

Hey Madison, why don't you create some sort of skeleton beat like you did for fugly.

I will record some bits to your beat and you can take them and make some loops and a tune.

Create your real beat after you get my loops. I just need to play in time with your beat.

Here's a couple colabs we came up with
Collaboration3


collab3c.mp3

[madison]

sounds cool.
gimme a day or so to get these other projects out of the way and we'll give her a shot.

[madison]

EL,
I have thousands of drum samples so it would take me forever just to pick and chose and there is not a defined direction.
Don't get me wrong, I have the feeling you are like me....there doesn't have to be a "defined direction"
Here is what I would propose:
Get the ball rolling giving out your favorite rif, lick of the moment/week/year.
Put a beat to it (any beat).
Pan the guitar right and the beat left, make sure they don't bleed!
Give a time signature in BPM.
Lay it on me dude.

[EL34]

I create most of my stuff starting with the beat.

I hear the beat and then ideas start to flow.

I don't have any ideas at the moment, that's why I wanted to do something with someone that can do loops and beats.

[madison]

aaah, got it.
What do you feel like? (rock, rumba, rap?)
I am into very steady but hopefully not too boring stuff
usually around 105-120 bpm.

[EL34]

You da man, do whatever you like, I can work with anything.

No pressure here, I was just throwing out the collaboration idea if you wanted to.
It's not a big deal, if you don't have time or whatever.

[madison]

No problem at all, gimme a sec.
I think I found a funky little something you can get going on.
Should be interesting.
3 minutes worth okay?
It will just be a loop of a simple beat.

[EL34]

Ok, got it.
Sounds like 110 BPM?

I mess with it in a while.

[EL34]

I have 4 mp3 files for you to mess with.
3 files are in the key of E, A and B so you can make a progression if you need to.
One is effects and rude noises.

There's a ton of stuff. Hopefully there is some useable stuff here. I was just rambling and switching presets in guitar rig.

This one is in E
E.mp3

This one is in A
A.mp3

This one is in B
B.mp3

This one is Effects and rude noises.
EFFECTS.MP3

[madison]

Hopefully get to it before the end of the weekend but I have to pour a new concrete floor in my practice room.

[EL34]

Hahahaha, I just had a fun time throwing together some loops from the files I created above.
The light just went on about how to create precise loops and so I had to give it a go.

It will be fun to hear what is created from the very same files.

This is just a simple progression using the files and your beat file Madison.
Colaboration #1

After we finish this we need to get a group collaboration effort from several forum members.
Everyone contributes files to a common beat and then we all throw together some sort of mess from it all.

Anybody up for that?

[JayB]

LOL That's pretty cool Doug. It's very techno with a rock and roll feel to it and probably be a big hit on the dance floor. Reminds me of the shoegazers a little too. I'd put a metal feel to it in there somewhere but that's me. I have a hard time wrapping my head around that kind of style. I always end up with a boring un-lively tune.

[madison]

Pretty good!
Tricky getting the parts together huh?
Looping is definitely an easy way to get an idea down.
Sometimes if you speed up the tempo it will sound tighter.

[EL34]

Jay,
Ya ,man, this was just an excersise, once if figured out the loop thing.

Maybe we can all contribute and do some cool stuff on another project.
I like that amp of yours, you can throw in some sounds from it.

[EL34]

Madison,
It's not bad once you know the tempo.
Mixcraft makes it pretty easy.
110 BPM turns out to be 2182 ms.
1/4 that is 2182/4 In ms

My wav editing software was able to make loops very quickly and exactly the right length.

The big hurdle is coming up with the ideas on what loops to insert to make it sound good.  :D

[JayB]

I spiced it up a little for you guys. I ran it through some mastering. A raw wave file would of been better with no dithering applyed to it. Still came out good though.

I'm all for the colaboration idea Doug. I thought of bringing up the idea too, with everyones talent here it would be fun to see what it would turn into.


http://home.comcast.net/~jayjay67/colaboration.mp3

[EL34]

Ya, that's sounds way better.
What does the mastering do?

We need Bassmanster to weight in on this deal.

[JayB]

Basically it's a paragraphic eq and cut the sub bass below 20hz and the same above 15-20kHz. Or you could boost/cut any frequency you want. Then a loudness maximizer that will let you get the most loudness you want or can get. A harmonic exciter like a BBE sonic maximizer. A Multiband compressor, so you compress specific bands of frequency to keep the levels at a constant rate. Then a multiband stereo imager. Works with highs and lows or what ever band of frequencies you want. It makes sure the frequencies arrive at your ear at the same time. And it can widen the stereo image we hear also.  You can use software too called VST which will do the same thing. I believe mixcraft can do VST now when you update to the newest version. I'm not positive on that but I seem to remember their site talking about that. I use my rack eq, compressor and BBE then run it through a stereo image and loudness VST through cakewalk sonar. When I did the non-tube thing in the late eighties, I ended up parts I never thought I use again. The cool thing about the software VST is that you can change the order of the signal chain on the fly. Where I have to change the order of the rack effects from my mixer which is a pain. I've been eyeing Izotope's master suite but it's pricey. I'm thinking freebe VST's out there will be just as good.

[JayB]

Oh ya, dithering is applied at the very end. Most software can do that too. When it's converted to cd which is 16bit, the dithering takes out the zero bytes. Kind of sounds like a high end hiss to my ears.

[madison]

Hey Jay B.
Sounds great, like somebody hit the Loudness button.
Or, some of those enhancement things on mp3 players.

[EL34]

Jay,
I can run VST and Direct X effects in Mixcraft.
Any freebie VST mastering effects out there?
Probably not, just wishing.

[OldHouseScott]

Lots of interesting VST stuff out there at KVR.

I like these plugs. Good and free!

[EL34]

Scott,
The classic series comes free with Mixcraft.
Got those already.

I'll check out the other link.

[JayB]

Here's more links. I'm sure there is more I havn't found yet.

http://www.rocketloop.com/free-vst-plugins.php?mode=cat&show_cat=2

http://www.ismusic.ne.jp/slim_slow_slider/vst/#c3

http://www.smartelectronix.com/~magnus/

http://beatmax.madtracker.net/mt2tutor/vst/e_vst_resources.htm


http://www.x-buz.com/BuzCompFree.html   An excellent multiband compressor for free.


http://www.voxengo.com   some fairly cheap ones here.

[Gman]

The ultimate (free) effects plug-in list that I have found so far is at-

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9780

There are probably 75-100 listed.

[EL34]

Madison, Where are ya?

Waiting to get a listen on collaboration.

[Bassmanster]

I'm in.  Let me get caught up on this data-filled thread...

 :D

[Bassmanster]

I think I'm in sync.  So basically I can throw down some MP3s in E major at exactly 110 bpm?   Is that the way to do it?  I can make them exactly one loop long.  Stereo or mono?

I can also do apple loops but I doubt that'll do any good.  I'll have to see if I can do MIDI or some other kind of acidized file for key and bpm changes.  But I'm guessing it'll just be an MP3.

It'll be good to learn about mastering too.  I wish GB had a maximizer and an exciter.  It does have MB compression.

What do ya want from me, my usual twangy stuff w/ whammy and volume swells and amp tremolo?  Trem picking?  Bass parts?

EL34 Edit: Madison has his own methods too. I have been taking the sound clips, finding a cool riff or sound then editing the sound file down to an exact length loop.
This is the basics. I had a 4/4 - 110 BPM drum track. 110 BPM is 2182ms every 4 beats. (one second is 1000ms). I was editing most of my loops to be 2182 ms and then repeating them back to back if they had to be 8 or 16 beats long. A few clips I used had riffs that were 8 beats long as so I edited my wav file to be 4364ms long which is the length of 8 beats. see the link above with a BPM calculator. It will give you times for any BPM.
This all make sense?

[EL34]

Nah, let's start a fresh collaboration, this was just an experiment.

I was thinking that we/someone come up with a beat that we all like at an exact tempo like 110 BPM or whatever.

Then we all contribute some sound clips like I did above.

We can take all the sounds and make our own tune from everyones snipets, but you have to use the provided sounds so we all have the same tools.

Hows that idea sound?

Jay said he could contribute some sounds from his cool amp.

You could lay down whatever you like without the beat in your clips but play along to the beat so we are all in time. Your clip contribution can just be a bunch of short sounds or if you have a bunch, split it into a few clips.

Anyone got any other ideas

[Bassmanster]

OK that all makes sense but do we have to be in key?

How about A minor?

[EL34]

See my edit in RED above too.

Ya, we would have to all agree on a key so that we could make a progression work if you wanted to do one.

Check it out. I re-mixed the first collaboration tune again so the guitar was not so muddy.
Collaboration3

Don't know where Madison is, must be working on his floor or else he's creating a masterpiece.

[Bassmanster]

Yup, that's a tight guitar sound now.

I think I've got it.

Prolly record a few tomorrow nite.

[madison]

Doing floor til 3 am the other night  :-[

I have it put together.3 minutes worth.
There is a space in the middle for a guitar solo.
I was thinking I would toss a solo in there but maybe I will just post it and let everyone else have a go at it?

[Bassmanster]

OK, I think I'm busy... it might not be tonight...this week then.   :-[

[EL34]

We need to have a beat first and then all decide on a key.

[madison]

What kinda beat?

[EL34]

Rock is fine with me, but anything will work I suppose.
That way you can do metal stuff, whatever.
What says you Bassmanster, Gman, Jay?

[Bassmanster]

Fine.  I found a straight rock GB beat I like last night.  I'll post it later.

I'm off today.   ;D ;D ;D ;D :o :o :o :o ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) :D :D :)

[madison]

What kind of theme or image are we dealing with this time?
No more looney toons!(though that is damn fun but waaaaay too easy)

[EL34]

Hmm, theme?
European or African?
I don't know that!

That's too much for my Bwain to grab onto right now.

Maybe this is going to be harder than I thought it would.
I haven't been feeling very creative lately.
Somebody take control and tell me what to do.  
[smiley=faint.gif] [smiley=see_stars.gif] [smiley=happydead.gif] [smiley=flies.gif] [smiley=blink.gif]

[madison]

you ,might need some bongos!
(I hope the sight updates soon)

http://www.myspace.com/youknowthenames

[Bassmanster]

http://www.barrierislandgraphics.com/forumfiles/P90%2Emp3  


8 bars at 130.

[EL34]

I like Bongos', file not up yet.

8 bars at 130 is nice.

[madison]

Okay, try now.
I  put bongos on Bassmanster's 130 and took out a crash or two.
No/Yes? :-?
http://www.myspace.com/youknowthenames

[EL34]

Both are fine.
Bongo's give me a jungle image.

I'm already working on something but it is going to be way weird.

[Bassmanster]

I'll throw out some harmonically vague riff loops for this beat later.

[JayB]

Any key decided on? Sounds kind of a funk beat there.

[Bassmanster]

Put something on it and we'll go.

I threw out some guitar licks in Am and A7 on the other thread.

[EL34]

I'm on hold for a bit, but I'll be back.

[JayB]

Cool, that might fit with what I regurgitated.  ;D


All in A

http://home.comcast.net/~jayjay67/colab.mp3