Blackface Fender's (Coupling Caps) What's Best to use?

[Doc58]

 
   There's alotta Brands of Coupling Caps out there...some expensive, some...not so expensive.
***Is there anyone out there that has past experience with Vintage Super Reverbs' when it comes to replacing the Coupling Caps and getting that Tone     
The Blue Molded Caps are great but there comes a time when all Coupling Caps meet their end. 
   I've been told the Orange Drops are REALLY BRIGHT...I've also been told the Mallory 150's work out pretty good...What about all these high dollar $$$ Jupiter Caps, etc. out there...
Are they the Holy Grail of the Coupling Cap?
    ***My next question is a bit of an off topic but can someone give me an idea of exactly HOW BRIGHT Super Reverbs tend to be...(with the Bright Switch Off)
    ***What is the general overall opinion of the Silver Mica Cap for the Tone Stack in Blackface Amps? Subjective Call...Is Great Tone Subjective?
     

[tubeswell]

I like mustard caps and blue astrons because of their retro look, but pretty much any film cap of the appropriate voltage rating and capacitance will do.

Re: the small caps, I find disc ceramics tend to be harsh and prefer the mica caps where values in the pF range are called  for.

[Willabe]

    ***My next question is a bit of an off topic but can someone give me an idea of exactly HOW BRIGHT Super Reverbs tend to be...(with the Bright Switch Off)

I had a BF SR that dated to 67" from all the parts codes in it. But it was all pre CBS/65" as far as circuit layout, parts, wire and had Jensen alnico 10" in it. I giged with that amp for years and I never had a single problem with it. I did change the ceramic disk caps to silver mica.

I played a stock 62" reissue rosewood fretboard Strat through it with the bass set on 3 or 4, mid at 7 to 10 and treble set to 7, with bright switch off. Volume was any where from 5 to 7, verb at 2 1/2 to 3. For lead I lived on the neck pup and for rhythm I used the middle pup most of the time. Never used the bridge pup by itself.

It was never bright sounding, was nice and full with out bottom end mud but still had nice chime to it.


            Brad         

[Ed_Chambley]

I have 4 SR's.  One is all original 64 and has never left my fathers house and has never left mine as well.  It sounds really good.  I have a 67 with jensens for the classic SR sound.  It has Sprague atoms and Mallory's, but it still has ceramic.  Not harsh at all.  I have a 68 and tried some of the SoZo blues in it.  There is a difference, but I would not pay the cost for them.  I got a big box of SoZo caps in with some other things I bought from someone who was selling all his stuff.  I have a 73 which is converted to AB763 and has vintage yellow SoZo caps in it.  Truth be told, I really cannot tell much difference and simply would not pay the price for expensive caps.  This is a topic which comes up often and I cannot say for sure, but I would bet if I changed all the caps in someones amp with Xicon and not tell them, I don't think they would notice unless it needed a cap job.  I have begun using Solen for durability.  If a cap will last longer then cost is justified.  I just built a Princeton board using all generic yellow caps.  Some were Mojo Dijon as they call them and some were Vishay from Mouser.  The only electrolytic is the filter cap can.  It sounds just like a Princeton I have with SoZo blues.

So, for what it is worth I usually pony-up for better pots, wire and toobs with the money not spent on on hand rolled caps made on the thigh of the playmate of the year and as HBP says, dipped in Extra Virgin Olive Oil.  I do stick with better resistors.

[phsyconoodler]

I don't find orange drops to be too bright at all.As long as they are the correct values.They can sound very good.
  I prefer Mojo Dijons though and have used them in Super Reverbs with great results.They are a bit darker and old-school sounding.The orange drops are a bit hi-fi,more detailed which can be confused with bright.

 I have built amps with Xicons and they sound good,but they definitely are missing something.The orange drops and Mojo Dijons have more of everything in the tone.

 The differences are subtle but they are there from cap to cap.It's like tuning a car with generic spark plus and wires and such.They run fine but the more expensive stuff kicks it up a little bit,maybe not enough to justify the added expense,but it is better nonetheless.
  As you get to be a better player,you want more from your amp.How much more depends on the depth of your pockets.

[Doc58]

I wound up using the Mallory 150's...they sound pretty good.
Once I changed the Coupling Caps the Treble was awfully bright to me...finally after tweaking around I removed the Mullard NOS 5ar4 and the Treble became Nice and Chimey and Violin'ish!  WTF?
The Mullard provided a bit more sag than I wanted (I suddenly noticed the Sag amount so I changed the Tube and put in a JJ GZ34) and walla, the Treble smoothed out...(treble was brittle, Tinny, and bright, just as though I had the Bright Cap Switch  On...) That's TOO BRIGHT!
Voltage Change I guess...sorta re-biased the pre-amp tubes a little...what ever it did, I'm happier with the Treble for sure.
Everywhere I read these days folks are complaining about how bright their Super Reverbs are...Most of them just need to turn off the Bright Switch! 

[smackoj]

Ed C << I do stick with 'better resistors' >>  what brand or brands would that be senor?

thx,   

[HotBluePlates]

***Is there anyone out there that has past experience with Vintage Super Reverbs' when it comes to replacing the Coupling Caps and getting that Tone     
The Blue Molded Caps are great but there comes a time when all Coupling Caps meet their end. 

I've never seen a leaky or failed blue molded cap in a vintage Fender. I would have left them alone.

That said, you should compare caps by the dielectric material used as an insulator in the cap. In general, any slight tone changes will follow a change of dielectric material.

I might be wrong, but I think the blue molded caps were polyester dielectric. Mallory 150's and 225P orange drops are polyester.

715P/716P orange drops (the original type everyone probably used of these) are polypropylene dielectric. Polyypropylene makes for a more-perfect cap, but folks usually hear it to have more treble/bass than polyester. By comparison, polyester has a sound that seems to be pushed more to midrange. Regardless, depending on the amp/speakers, the difference could be subtle.

I've used super-expensive caps before, and found the difference (if any) didn't warrant the price. My last amp used el-cheapo no-name "yellow caps" with a polyester dielectric that otherwise look like Mallory 150's. I'd have to look again to see if there's even a manufacturer name on them, but they work fine and the amp sounds good.

   ***My next question is a bit of an off topic but can someone give me an idea of exactly HOW BRIGHT Super Reverbs tend to be...(with the Bright Switch Off)

No brighter than any other blackface amp without a bright switch, or with the switch off. My old '67 Super Reverb sounded essentially the same as my old '67 Princeton Reverb, but louder and with a different quality to the breakup.

And there is a Treble control... if the amp is bright, why can't you turn that down a bit?

And the bright switch is just a treble bypass around the volume control, as you might use in a guitar; the sound gets brighter as you turn down the volume control, but with volume at max, there's no difference between bright switch on or off.

[Ed_Chambley]

Ed C << I do stick with 'better resistors' >>  what brand or brands would that be senor?

thx,   

According to position in the amp. I like quiet, clean so I use Dale 1 watt or Dale/Vishay.  Ohmite wirewounds in larger wattage.  I have been using the attached a lot recently.  They have very strong leeds and I just completed a build using them almost everywhere.  It is a high gain modified JCM 800.  These are very quite.

[DummyLoad]

IMO, with caps brand & film type matters not so much as what will meet operating voltage spec and fits.


--pete

[HotBluePlates]

Yep. My classic response to this line of questioning is that a cap-value change (0.01uF instead of a 0.047uF) will result in a massively-bigger tone change than a dielectric material or cap brand change.

That and Teflon caps are bigger than polystyrene caps are bigger than ceramic/mica caps are bigger than polypropylene caps are bigger than polyester caps are bigger than electrolytic caps, for the same value.

So sometimes you pick your "ultimate cap" only to find it won't fit in the space you have allotted for it in the chassis.