Lead Free?

[spacelabstudio]

So I made an amp using lead free solder from Radio Shack.  I can't necessarily blame the problems on the solder, but I have my suspicions.  It clicks intermittently and the wiring is microphonic.  Doing a bunch of work with lead at my home, where I prepare meals, and have a kiddo running around, makes me nervous.  I try to keep things clean and there's no denying 60/40 is much nicer to work with.  But do any of you guys use lead free stuff and make it work?  Any tips?  Any different kind of solder I should be using?  Is silver easier to work with?  (I don't buy audiophile snake oil, but I do like building something that, you know, works.)

[sluckey]

If you make a good mechanical connection first you should not have any problems with electronic solder.

[eleventeen]

You don't want to use silver solder; I don't believe it's available w/o an acid flux if it is even fluxed at all. (You could dip the solder-end & paint the joint w/liquid flux, I suppose) but silver solder has a much higher melting point than lead/tin. With tube stuff, it probably wouldn't matter, with solid state stuff, I think it would be a disaster. But even w/tube stuff, IMO you would have to work really quick to avoid insulation meltback.


Regular solder is fine, just set up a little fan so you get some cross-ventilation. It would be different if you were on a production line and soldering all day long.

[spacelabstudio]

You don't want to use silver solder; I don't believe it's available w/o an acid flux if it is even fluxed at all. (You could dip the solder-end & paint the joint w/liquid flux, I suppose) but silver solder has a much higher melting point than lead/tin. With tube stuff, it probably wouldn't matter, with solid state stuff, I think it would be a disaster. But even w/tube stuff, IMO you would have to work really quick to avoid insulation meltback.


Regular solder is fine, just set up a little fan so you get some cross-ventilation. It would be different if you were on a production line and soldering all day long.

I'm not really worried about the fumes.  I'm worried more about all the little flecks of it getting on hands, etc... and finding their way to someone's mouth.  I don't make much mess, but there's usually a little splatter or flakes to clean up, especially if I have to rework anything.


Chris

[bnwitt]

Ok, lead was introduced into solder back in the 50's to reduce joint cracking and whiskering.  Whiskering between non lead solder joints has shut down some very expensive satellites and really important medical equipment.  Lead solder is banned by the ROHS standard in everything but government and medical equipment.  Why not those two?  Because those two types of equipment are either too important to health or too expensive to make a house call ... ROHS solder causes equipment to fail in short life spans due to whiskering and joint cracking ...

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[kagliostro]

Bnwitt  



K

[spacelabstudio]

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[spacelabstudio]

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[sluckey]

I have some experience with lead free solder... in plumbing. I would never use it for electronics though. My first choice for the type of electronics work I do is 63/37 with flux core.

I understand your concerns about lead around kids. But if you clean up it should be fine. A food prep area is not the best place to do this kind of work but in my younger days I did a lot of soldering on the kitchen table. I hated not being able to leave a project scattered on the table though. Thankfully I have a better alternative workspace now, and no little ones crawling about.

[lego4040]

I use lead free solder for plumbing at my job. No problems at all with it. For electrical technology I'd have to take your guys advice. As for these new "safer" alternatives, hogwash. I'm a licensed refrigeration operating engineer and all these new replacement freons are worse then the last ones. We used to use water  as refrigerant and there was never a problem. The problem was the operating pressures which to run them but if there was a failure there was no environment impact if there was a failure. We switched to ammonia for greater cooling capacity but we all no what ammonia does to you when we breath it in, but with leak detector alarms we were able to evacuate and shut down safely. Freons, created by"DuPont" yes the lovely maker of plastic and destroyer of hemp products did the same thing to this industry. They said this product can be run at a safer pressure and lower electrical usage eliminating dangerous high voltage and pressures. Crap that is, we all know at higher voltage we can use less amperage( lower operating costs) less money for Con Ed. I'm gonna stop now cause I'm getting frustrated with these monopolies. 

[6G6]

I have had to work with lead free solder.
I don't like it. It takes more heat to flow, potentially causing damage from the heat.
It never flows or sticks as well as real solder.
It is brittle and tends to crack.
Sometimes, just reflowing everthing, with a little real solder can fix tiny cracks that you never saw.
All in all, I agree with BNWitt.
 

[kagliostro]

I don't use lead-free

simply I tried it but ......

its use made ​​it hard to solder and so I stopped to use it

I stocked up on 60/40 and if I can find it at a good price I buy it

I hope, for when I finish my stocks, the industry has marketed a new material that can combine the characteristics of the old 60/40 with the lead-free one

or a fantastic laser iron that solves this problems is on the market 

K

[loogie]

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[loogie]

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[Jack1962]

I have and still do use both types (with and without lead) both work well if done correctly , I would prefer to use 70/30 but it's hard to find these days.

[G._Hoffman]

You don't want to use silver solder; I don't believe it's available w/o an acid flux if it is even fluxed at all.

Of course they do.  There are all sorts of electronics solder that are made with silver - both with and without lead.  A bunch of different fluxes available too, including the traditional rosin's, water-based, no-clean, etc.  Not really much point behind those unless you are doing a fairly niche product. 

But yeah, using lead free solder is a giant PITA, and I avoid it as much as possible.  A high temperature iron and a high thermal capacity tip help a lot.  They'll never look very good.


Gabriel

[bnwitt]

I'm not sure what the deleted content was as this thread is so old now but I thought I would post these links to two articles regarding lead free solder and it's downside.

http://www.militaryaerospace.com/articles/print/volume-16/issue-10/news/trends/lead-free-solder-a-train-wreck-in-the-making.html

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/21151552/ns/technology_and_science-science/t/danger-lead-free-electronics-tin-whiskers/

[AZJimC]

I grew up with a radiator shop in my yard, and inside was a tank about 3'x5' and 2 1/2 ft deep. It had a rack to support automotive radiators while soldering on them, so All my young life I would stick hands and whatever in this tank that had about a foot of lead based solder droppings in the bottom. every couple months, we would scoop all that crap out of the tank, and place it in a large crucible and melt it down and scoop the dregs of the top, to re purify it, and then pour it into molds that rendered sticks of solder to be used in the shop. Arguably, I'm okay. There is nothing wrong with me, with me, with me, HAHA.
[rant]
It irritates me that, due to the EPA primarily, we can't even put lead back into the ground, where it came from, without a regulatory panic. We cannot, and never will be able to get American made tubes again, due to the chemical processes required in manufacture, and it is for the better part ridiculous IMO. Lead was one of the earliest metals, because it is the most plentiful in the ground. Yes, I do understand that lead does poison animals/humans, however we always avoided eating chunks of it. Doesn't taste very good, and is hard to chew. I used to bite the lead bullets off of 22 shells so I could play with the gunpowder, and I do remember swallowing one. I'm sure it passed without consequence. That was accidental, of course, and not a regular occurrence.

I use 60/40 without issues, as most of us do, having tried the RHOS compliant crap, and, while it does okay with careful use, it looks like crap, and leaves me with a bad feeling like I haven't done the best work possible. IMO we could get along much better without most of the three letter agencies of our federal government. [/rant]

[sluckey]

Lot's of uses for lead. Do any of you old hunters remember this?

Cut a 2 to 2.5" circle from a lead sheet. Roof flashing was always available. Fold the circle in half and cut a 1/4" smaller half circle leaving you with a 2" donut. Unfold the donut slightly. Now split a condom (we called them rubbers) in half so you have a flat sheet of latex. Have a helper stretch the rubber tight while you slip your lead donut over it and crimp it tightly onto the rubber. Trim the rubber to the outside shape of the donut. You end up with a 'C' shaped object with a rubber stretched across it. Finally, place the object in your mouth and bend it with your tongue until it fits your mouth. Start making sucking/clucking motions. With just a little practice you will have a very decent sounding turkey yelper.

[Ken Moon]

I've found that the soldering iron temp has to be at least 800 degrees, vs the 700 degrees I use for good ole SnPb (tin/lead) 63/37 Kester #44 solder, when using lead-free.

Lead-free solder also doesn't flow as nicely, even when using liquid flux (which I use on every joint).

Lastly, it's harder to clean completely off. When I get done with a turret board, I hold it over a trash can and flood it with spray flux remover. Clean as a whistle in about 10 seconds, with no white residue left behind, like when cleaning with alcohol.

So get a few 1-lb rolls of Kester 44 63/37 (60/40 is fine too) at about $30 each shipped, and some liquid flux (flux pen or brush/bottle)and you'll be set for life 

btw, I like .031 diameter for most work...