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Hoffman Amps Forum image Author Topic: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion  (Read 4212 times)

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Offline jsjs94

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silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« on: November 08, 2018, 11:07:08 pm »
I recently picked up a ‘60’s era Silvertone Hifi amplifier.  I’ve looked into converting it to a guitar amplifier, but being new to tube electronics, I have had difficulty figuring out how to go about it. 

https://music-electronics-forum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=33517&d=1428209221

The schematic shows the input going directly to the volume pot and then to the first stage of the 12AX7.  No other schematic I’ve looked at has the input wired like that.  I’ve found one discussion of this amp at: https://music-electronics-forum.com/showthread.php?t=39201.  Honestly, though, I am not able to follow what they’re talking about (other than removing R2).  I have read that the 6X5/GT rectifier tube can be problematic. 

One thing I’ve been considering is swapping the 6X5/GT for a 5Y3 and rewiring the whole thing using a Fender Champ Schematic.

Thoughts?

Offline TIMBO

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2018, 12:50:57 am »
Yep, rewire it as a champ. :icon_biggrin:

Offline sluckey

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2018, 08:30:33 am »
That little amp is just begging to be a Champ. Swapping the 6X5/GT for a 5Y3 is not possible. I would stay with the 6X5 or change the socket and use an EZ81. Or just pull the rectifier tube and install two 1N4007 diodes on the socket.
A schematic, layout, and hi-rez pics are very useful for troubleshooting your amp. Don't wait to be asked. JUST DO IT!

Offline PRR

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2018, 10:59:43 am »
> input going directly to the volume pot and then to the first stage of the 12AX7.  No other schematic I’ve looked at has the input wired like that.

That's normal for Hi-Fi amps. Sources are already pre-amplified (or hot), gain is low. Putting Volume pot in front avoids overloading.

Guitar wants more gain for easy playing. In this plan R2 reduces gain by NFB from 2nd plate to 1st plate. Your first crack is to snip one end of R2.

Now you have gain. Maybe pretty good for guitar. BUT there's hiss in the 1st tube. Working at "10" and playing steady, you won't hear the hiss under the guitar. But turning to "5" turns-down guitar but does not turn-down hiss! The thing hisses the same at all settings.

There ARE guitar amps this way. Mostly very cheap practice models. There may be a SilverTone like this.

But since guitar will not overload the 1st stage, a better plan is to re-wire the Volume pot between 1st and 2nd stages. Yes, like any Champ. It is interesting that this even uses the same 1st stage resistor values as Champ (most Fender). That should play fine.

The 1K R22 is "large", drops power. But you gotta ask: is this ever going to fill a stadium? No. Would dinking it up from 4 Watts to 5 Watts get more gigs and groupies? No. Does the 1K value significantly cut the hum (on a large speaker)? Yes. Leave it alone.

C12 is probably perished. Get a few 40uFd 400V caps.

The 6X5 is NOT a problem. Maybe if you have a fleet of bottle rectifiers working every day, the 5U4s are a bit more reliable, but I have not seen that. Leave it alone.

The grid-leak of the 6V6 is a whopping 5 Megs, and it works 10 Watt plate dissipation. Book says 1/10th that value. As the tube goes gassy the bias will drift way off. Toward melt-down! Again the 1K R22 is a mild benefit, dropping B+ as 6V6 current rises. Me, I think you have a "Tone" knob on the guitar, you should bypass the 5Meg pot with a 470K resistor. (The knob will still "tone" when turned full-down.)
« Last Edit: November 10, 2018, 05:19:56 pm by PRR »

Offline PRR

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2018, 07:45:16 pm »
me> There may be a SilverTone like this.

SilverTone 1300 has out-front volume knobs, and is not the cheapest box on the block.

Offline jsjs94

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2018, 12:34:28 am »
Wow!

Thanks for all the advice, RRR.

I'll get started tomorrow and try posting some pictures.

Offline sluckey

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2018, 05:40:02 am »
You can't convert your hifi amp to that 1300 guitar amp.
A schematic, layout, and hi-rez pics are very useful for troubleshooting your amp. Don't wait to be asked. JUST DO IT!

Offline PRR

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2018, 05:18:01 pm »
> You can't convert your hifi amp to that 1300 guitar amp.

Nor should you want to. Just confirming my guess that SilverTone did do such a thing.

Pot-in-front is generally a good plan for hi-fi line-amp, a Poor Plan for a guitar amp.

And of course the 1300 is double the tubes and power demand. 

Offline sluckey

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Re: silvertone Hifi to Guitar Amplifier conversion
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2018, 06:11:45 pm »
Ahh, I missed the point of showing the 1300. Now I see.

A schematic, layout, and hi-rez pics are very useful for troubleshooting your amp. Don't wait to be asked. JUST DO IT!

 


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