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Hoffman Amps Forum image Author Topic: Univox Bias Rectifier Information  (Read 2024 times)

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Offline astronomicum

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Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« on: September 22, 2021, 07:12:13 pm »
I have come across these rectifiers in the Bias circuits of the Univox U235PB and U320PB. Can't find any info on these at all. They are labeled Selemax 117V 20mA. When tested, they do not show typical readings either in Diode test, or Resistance test modes. The Diode test mode shows no DC voltage in both forward and reverse directions, and resistance shows extremely high or open in sometimes one or both directions; same results either in or out of circuit, but yet they work. Not acting like a solid state rectifier at all. The graph paper is 1/4". Just curious if anyone knows anything about these. Thanks.

Offline sluckey

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2021, 07:28:23 pm »
Just follow the schematic and replace all three diodes with 1N4007s.
A schematic, layout, and hi-rez pics are very useful for troubleshooting your amp. Don't wait to be asked. JUST DO IT!

Offline Latole

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2021, 03:51:25 am »
Short answer; A diode rectifier are always same, only package is different

SD-1Y is the one :

Offline PRR

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2021, 12:02:45 pm »
> The Diode test mode shows

These old things may have higher forward voltage than your meter expects. You could try them on 24VAC and a resistor load. However if they are that old, from the dawn of solid rectifiers, I agree: 1N4007.(*)

(*) Yes, 1N4002 would be fine. Today 4001 to 4007 are all the same price. But I found proof of what I remembered: 1N4007 used to be GROSSLY more expensive, and 1N4006 was not cheap neither.


Offline astronomicum

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2021, 07:13:33 pm »
As I discovered today, “from the dawn of solid rectifiers”, as PRR stated, is probably not far from mark, and these rectifiers change the meaning of “silicon wafers”, for me anyway. Intrigued by PRR’s suggestion, I conducted some comparative testing with a 1N4007 and my results show these Selemax rectifiers have a lower output on average of 5.4VDC with a supply of 20VAC (-27.0VDC for the 1N4007 vs. -21.1VDC and -22.1VDC for the two Selemax units tested). Appears to explain why multimeter “Diode mode” tests are not showing typical diode results. I then decided to do a forensic examination and upon opening one of the units, discovered a stack of aluminum “wafers” (pics 1 and 2). Once removed and separated, I found Anode and Cathode terminals (marked), a copper compression “spring” (to the far right in pic 3), plain aluminum spacers, and eight (8), what I believe to be, silicon coated aluminum wafers. Each of the silicon wafers had a lighter and darker side, and without specific testing to verify, would assume one side coated with an “N” doped silicon material, and the other coated with a “P” doped material. The silicon coated wafers were layered between the terminals and aluminum spacers in two groups of four (4) (from left to right, positions 4-7 and 11-14 in pic 3). Where each of silicon wafers touched, an “N” and “P” side were facing one another (dark and light sides), effectively creating seven (7) series “N-P” junctions. This would appear to explain the lower voltage output (7 x 0.7V = 4.9V) compared to the 1N4007. I then took a look at a silicon wafer under a microscope (15x) and observed what I would characterize as heat fused silicon granules to an aluminum substrate (pic 4). You can see the rounded shapes of the granules indicating a degree of melting I would assume used to bond the silicon to the aluminum. So why so many junctions? Way out on a limb here but I would say that due to the potential for any single junction to short due to the thinness of each junction and that the junctions are not fused (each wafer can move freely), an engineer (or bean counter) worked some math to show that more junctions had a lower probability of complete failure. And since this rectifier was to be used in a bias circuit, its low current capacity, and the fact that a junction failure (short) would not melt down the output valves,  made this rectifier acceptable for this bias circuit application.

Offline PRR

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2021, 07:56:55 pm »
Um, this is not Silicon but a SELENIUM rectifier. Other possibilities are Copper Oxide and Germanium and even Electrolytic, but "Selemax" is a clue.

And Selenium is toxic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selenium
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selenium#Toxicity

The complete rectifier was safe to handle, but I really wish you had not opened it.

The other way we know Selenium is the large and ever-increasing voltage drop. Eventually most of the power budgeted for the load is cooking the rectifier, the Selenium "burns", and it STINKs.

Since it is small, put it in a Baggie wrapped in a newspaper and in a garbage bag. Wash Your Hands!

And yes, any failure of this rectifier would melt the output tubes. But Selenium rarely fails in a month or a year. But at 50+ years the stock advice is "Get rid of that!!"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selenium_rectifier
Selenium rectifiers - the smelliest components ever
« Last Edit: September 25, 2021, 08:09:28 pm by PRR »

Offline astronomicum

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Re: Univox Bias Rectifier Information
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2021, 08:13:24 am »
Thank you for the infomation. Very interesting. Always saftey first so I never touched the components. I will dispose of these properly.

 


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