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Hoffman Amps Forum image Author Topic: Fetron the Unknown  (Read 17106 times)

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Offline kagliostro

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Fetron the Unknown
« on: November 25, 2011, 09:16:24 am »
I've just discovered this and want to share

maybe someone knows well what was that stuff, but I think that more than one, like me, haven't listen before this name - FETRON

http://www.slack.com/misc/Fetron.pdf

http://www.philipstorr.id.au/radio/eleven/fetron.htm

I learned that Mesa Boogie used it in some amps in place of 12ax7 tube the TR1009 Fetron

does someone has experienced about and has a schematic to rebuild nowadays those TR1009 as to give a try to it ?

after all the use of this obsolete stuff will be useful for some use, like FX Loop exit implemented by Tubenit in some of his latest amps ..........

at Mostef follies they give a lot of indications but not exact values of the components

Kagliostro



« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 04:23:05 pm by PRR »
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Offline phsyconoodler

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2011, 12:53:03 pm »
There is a company that was at NAMM a couple of years ago doing the same thing and promising the moon,just like Fetron did.They actually do work but the tone is questionable as well as the price.Astronomical and unrealistic prices killed them dead in their tracks.
  I have one of the Mesa Fetrons but I haven't tried it yet to see what it sounds like.
I don't think the home builder would be able to build one small enough to use without special equipment.
My .02.

Update: found the link www.wattgrinder.com
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 01:05:58 pm by phsyconoodler »
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Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2011, 01:41:35 pm »
From an italian forum

Quote
Musically FETRON is slightly less hot and less noisy, more inclined HI-gain and strong on average.
The highs are less 'round' with respect to the tube.

(the author refers to the use as V1 in Mesa Boogie Mark II)

I think that that company (at Namm) want to make many money from an old idea selling it as a new one

Personally I'm not able to draw a schematic with SS components to obtain a copy of a 12a*7 tube, but I'm convinced (as stated at Mosfet Follies) that can be done without a great effort

sure the sound of a tube will be different

Not to replace all the tubes in an amp, only an aid to solve some problems or to give a different tone

Kagliostro
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 01:44:05 pm by kagliostro »
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Offline PRR

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2011, 01:47:41 am »
The FETron plan will NOT emulate a triode well. It is strongly pentode-like.

The problem with modern re-creation is that we can not find 300V JFETs today.

500V MOSFETs are easy but the biasing is different.

Teledyne had a good business, telephone companies with 5,000 tube amplifiers who wanted reduction in costs while saving-up for new all-transistor gear. Teledyne would select JFETs (they had millions) and resistor to work "same" in the specific socket, then make 5,000 alike. For one person "FETron"ing one socket, this may be a lot of time for no large benefit.

Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2011, 03:19:21 pm »
Thanks PRR

I've find this



the guy who posted it told that he has also the 12ax7 schematic

but this was in an old tread of the past year

I hope I can have those schematic,if possible, than I'll share it here

I also find this

http://www.tubecollector.org/nonvalve/fetron.htm

Kagliostro
« Last Edit: November 26, 2011, 03:22:49 pm by kagliostro »
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Offline dorrisant

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2013, 03:00:16 am »
Kagliostro, I can't seeanything but a "?" in your last post where you direct to what you've found...

PRR, check this out... Over 300v here:

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=79283.20

Does anyone have a schematic for the 12ax7 replacement?

Tony

« Last Edit: October 14, 2013, 03:02:51 am by dorrisant »

Offline HotBluePlates

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2013, 08:50:03 am »
PRR, check this out... Over 300v here:

No, that guy was saying he had a 350v supply, but only 40v on the JFET drain (the drain is equivalent to a tube's plate). So he must've had a big, big drain resistor dropping voltage in that circuit (and you always run the risk of startup destruction).

The poster pointed out modern JFETs don't seem to go above 45-50v on the drain.

Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2013, 09:21:51 am »
Do you mean this link ?

http://www.tubecollector.org/nonvalve/fetron.htm

I've no problem with the link  :dontknow:

I attach here the content of the link (some images)

and you can see a very BIG drop resistor inside of one of the fetron

K



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Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2013, 09:22:45 am »
The last image

K
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Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2013, 02:22:00 am »
I've this

K
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Offline jerrydyer

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2013, 11:10:08 am »
the JFET used in the Dumble Overdrive special can handle the plate voltage. I think thats what the dude at NAMM a few years ago used. I cant rememember the tube name but another site related to him was tone crusher . ? I think

Offline DummyLoad

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2013, 07:27:16 am »
the JFET used in the Dumble Overdrive special can handle the plate voltage.

i don't think that is correct. the dumpble uses a device similar to the 2N4416A (36V device) and a very large B+ dropping resistor is used for the J-FET stage.

http://www.el34world.com/charts/Schematics/files/dumble/jfet.pdf

these can though...

http://www.interfet.com/pdf/DS_2N6449_50.pdf

--pete

Offline dorrisant

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2013, 12:45:48 pm »
kagliostro, the pic in the 5th post shows a question mark... The latest list pic is good... Thank you!

HotBluePlates, I was referring to the use of a dropping resistor probably being included in the Fetron package, sorry for not being clear.

Tony

Offline kagliostro

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2013, 12:37:50 am »
Hi Tony

Quote
the pic in the 5th post shows a question mark... The latest list pic is good...

I think you mean post #4 (post #5 isn't mine)

In post #7 and #8 I put the images that are in the link at post #4

hoever I don't know why you don't see the images on the link, to me all is OK and I see it  :w2: :dontknow: :w2:

K
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Offline Satchmoeddie

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Re: Fetron the Unknown
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2022, 12:16:27 pm »
Every year at NAMM some new schlock is reintroducing a line of solid state devices just like the FETRON that plug into a 12AX7 or sometimes other tube sockets (usually the same pinout as a 12AX7) but they never ever stay around for long. Put an 18-0-18 or a 12-0-12 supply in a tube amp and run some JFET & MOSFET gain stages in it or use op amps or use any combination. The Dumble amps with the FET inputs used a quasi-universal TV repair JFET transistor from NTE. There are probably 30 to 100 transistors  in the NTE book alone that that NTE transistor can adequately replace in a vintage TV set. Those might run at 30 or 40 volts or so. The FETRON is (A) not a vacuum tube, and (B) it's a pair of cascode transistors, with a buffer. That makes it very similar to a pentode, but a solid state pentode. The Teledyne FETRON was kind of a piece of electric fecal matter. The JFETs were doped crystal imbedded into a quasi planar substrate mess with the passive parts soldered onto SMD pads on the substrate connected with gold wire leads. It was a nice idea, but by the time the process was perfected with a reliable monolithic design there were not really very many devices left still using tubes where it would be beneficial. Western Electric made their version called an HIN. Good luck finding one of those. The phone company burned up millions of both of them, just by using them. Today we can still find MOSFETs that will handle 400,600,1000 volts but not any JFETs. Not anymore.  If you have an old Phillips ECG or an NTE or one of the big old master cross reference simple semicon books you can find them, back in the 1970s, 1980s catalogs & books. NTE parts were and still are very expensive. Old NTE & old Phillips ECG catalogs are going to have the most common active electronic repair parts in them. A 1970s ECG catalog is going to have an awful lot of CRT TV transistors & ICs and lots of CB radio transistors & IC chips in it. By the 1990s lots of VCR parts. Who uses any of that stuff now?

 


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