Compression effect

[ernest]

Hey, anyone want to discuss Compression. 


I just started playing live for the first time in my 40 years on this terra firma and I think I need a compression pedal.   I’m playing a Tele through my small watt tube amps with a little bit of echo (FAB echo) and micing it at shows.   I’m playing lead and doing some twang riffs, nothing fast like Danny Gatton or anything but I feel I need to even out the tone and add some sustain.


I’ve been researching Compressor pedals and there are too many options to choose.  I don’t want to get stuck with a loud hiss or bypass issues, etc..from what I understand the Ross and Keeley pedals are what you want but I would love to have a tube compression pedal to go along with the rest of my gear.  200 buck for a Black Finger, I just couldn’t justify the cost right now. 


looking for a discussion on the effect itself and insight on which one to DIY, are there any tube DIY pedals, what do I need to do for what I’m wanting to accomplish.  I’m a bit lost.

[Willabe]

Have you read through this thread on compressors? I don't recall anything on tube compressors but it's a very good discussion on them anyway.

http://el34world.com/Forum/index.php?topic=16922.0


             Brad   

[Ed_Chambley]

If you are looking for squeez, a Dynacomp has been a standard and is cheap used.  It is a Ross circuit and stacks well but is a tads noisy.  The abrber tone press is nice but costs more.  I have an older version.  The Keeley is a great compressor, but doesn't stack well.  None of the floor tube compressors are for Country Squeez.

The boss is a good one but noisy.  It is also Ross.  Any optical will enhance your signal and not squash it.  Great for tone, not for Country.

The best all around is the Wampler EGO.  Expensive.  I have a Ross, Keeley, Philosophers, Boss, Wampler, Barber, and a Dyancomp.  I have a Diamond optical and a Joe Meek floor Q.  Probably a couple more.

If I wanted a country squeez on a budget I would get a Dynacomp and not the "special script" because it doesn't make enough difference to pay 20 cents more.  I still use it on my grab and go country pedal board.

I mostly use 3 because I have 3 pedal boards.  Wampler Ego, Diamond on my rock board and Dynacomp on my pedaltrain mini.  If you feel industrious, get a Dyancomp and replace the caps with higher quality ones and it will lessen the noise.  Still the stock Dynacomp is quieter than the Keeley if placed before Overdrive pedals.  The wampler acts as a buffer too and will help on long runs with high loss due to capacitance loss.  That is the reason I say it is the best.  It is quiet and stacks better than any others.  The Barber is next then the Dynacomp.  You can get a Dynacomp on Ebay for $30 if you watch.

[alerich]

The Boss is a good one but noisy.

Ditto on this. Especially if you dial up the Sustain control past 12:00. I ordered one of the Monte Allums mod kits for my Boss CS-3. It's an easy job and greatly reduced the hiss and noise floor of the pedal. I love the "snap" it gives when I play country licks. The kit mostly just subs better quality caps for the cheap stock components.

As an aside, I have used the MA mod kit for the Boss GE-7 EQ pedal, as well. Great results. It turned a horribly noisy stock pedal into a very useful tool. You could probably source the caps and parts yourself but I don't have the patience for such.

[ernest]

Country Squeez, Dynacomp is a Ross circuit,

Yes, this is good info.  I’ve been reading reviews, watching youtube, and you get overloaded, which one is the right one for what I’m doing.  This is the answer I’ve been wanting.  I’ve come close to pulling the trigger on BOSS cs, T-rex sustainer, couple other cheaper ones.. Big Crush, etc.   Yes I’m wanting Country squeez and I think upgrading the caps on a dynacomp is how I’m going to proceed.   Thanks




Willabe-thanks, I’ll read through this now.   no I didn’t search anything, just noticed there wasn’t much activity on the effects thread and posted anyways. 

[Ed_Chambley]

The Boss is a good one but noisy.

Ditto on this. Especially if you dial up the Sustain control past 12:00. I ordered one of the Monte Allums mod kits for my Boss CS-3. It's an easy job and greatly reduced the hiss and noise floor of the pedal. I love the "snap" it gives when I play country licks. The kit mostly just subs better quality caps for the cheap stock components.

As an aside, I have used the MA mod kit for the Boss GE-7 EQ pedal, as well. Great results. It turned a horribly noisy stock pedal into a very useful tool. You could probably source the caps and parts yourself but I don't have the patience for such.

Yessir! The boutique pedal business thrives on using quality components and doing smaller quantities.  That is how most get started.  I have modded a couple that have improved as well.  I call it reverencing the bean counter mojo.

[Platefire]

Ed talked me in trying a Dyna Comp after trying a couple of modded Boss CS-3's. The opto mods on the CS3 are really good but on my tele I love the dyna comp. The dyna comp does color your signal with a little fatness that really helps a vintage type set up tele---I mean with vintage wound single coil pickups. You was talking about a little twang and dyna/tele is a good combination. I would like to try the Wampler Ego eventually but pretty happy with what I got. Platefire

[ernest]

right on, I'm spending my saturday morning looking for a good used dyna comp that I plan on upgrading the caps.  The 2000 series from the 80s has me confused on what the dif would be.  Then there's the Custom Comp..still more research

[Ed_Chambley]

right on, I'm spending my saturday morning looking for a good used dyna comp that I plan on upgrading the caps.  The 2000 series from the 80s has me confused on what the dif would be.  Then there's the Custom Comp..still more research

The orange one.  Just look at a schematic and replace all the signal caps with new ones from Small Bear.  Or get a kit. It works great.

It is the pedal that made chicken picken in the 80's.  Set it to the cats eye position and pop those strings.

[Platefire]

I took out my ALCHEMY AUDIO modded Boss CS-3 out to test different settings and noticed I was getting ghost notes. It sound like someone humming odd harmonics with a slight delay more prevalent on notes played on g and b strings. I sent a e-mail to Johnny who does the mods but haven't heard from him yet. Platefire

[Ed_Chambley]

I took out my ALCHEMY AUDIO modded Boss CS-3 out to test different settings and noticed I was getting ghost notes. It sound like someone humming odd harmonics with a slight delay more prevalent on notes played on g and b strings. I sent a e-mail to Johnny who does the mods but haven't heard from him yet. Platefire

Plate, if you tap it on the floor does anything change?  Does it get worse when add sustain or volume or both?   

[Platefire]

Beat the daylights out of it and didn't change anything. Tried all the knobs from 0 to 100% to see how that affected it and none did except the attack that gets louder with a high attack, less at 9:00 and nothing at 0.

I heard from Johnny at alchemy audio. He seems to think the opamp may be loose in it's socket. He tried to explain how to get to it and push it back up tight in the socket. The 8 pin socket has a double opamp wrapped in electrical tape. I went in and just pushed on it down toward the board. I wasn't sure rather the socket was on the board or up inside the tapped up opamp??? I've never fooled with pedals before, so it's a new ballgame for me. Platefire

[Ed_Chambley]

Beat the daylights out of it and didn't change anything. Tried all the knobs from 0 to 100% to see how that affected it and none did except the attack that gets louder with a high attack, less at 9:00 and nothing at 0.

I heard from Johnny at alchemy audio. He seems to think the opamp may be loose in it's socket. He tried to explain how to get to it and push it back up tight in the socket. The 8 pin socket has a double opamp wrapped in electrical tape. I went in and just pushed on it down toward the board. I wasn't sure rather the socket was on the board or up inside the tapped up opamp??? I've never fooled with pedals before, so it's a new ballgame for me. Platefire

I am not sure, but I would think an opamp shouldn't have tape on it.
This pedal is not extremely complex.  I agree it could easily be the seating of the opamp, but usually when mods are done to pedals it is solder connections.  Hopefully you can simply use the schematic and see where the signal enters the compressor.  Prior to look at C4 and C5 as well.

[Platefire]

Ed, Thanks for the layout and schematic!

http://www.monteallums.com/pedal_mods.html

The mod is the Monte Allurns Opto mod that was performed by Alchemy Audio. For details of the mod go to link and scroll down to Boss CS-3 Opto Mod. You can there see all the changes included in that mod.

The reason for the electrical tape is it uses a dual opamp mounted on one 8 pin socket and the opamp has to be bent over to some degree make room and the tape is to insulate it from making contact with the case.

Johnny at Alchemy Audio thinks the opamp socket is not properly seated. I've taken it apart twice a push on the opamp toward the socket to push it down as far as it would go. After the second time of trying it worked briefly without ghost notes but the next time the ghost notes were back. He has told me to mail it back to him and let him have a look at it. I keep thinking I can fix it--but so far no good. I'm considering sending it back to him. Platefire

BTW-The Ghost notes hardly even show up using the bridge pickup. It occurs mostly on the neck pickup playing in the 5th to 8th frets on the g and b string. Just enough to be a nuisance.

[Ed_Chambley]

Ed, Thanks for the layout and schematic!

http://www.monteallums.com/pedal_mods.html

The mod is the Monte Allurns Opto mod that was performed by Alchemy Audio. For details of the mod go to link and scroll down to Boss CS-3 Opto Mod. You can there see all the changes included in that mod.

The reason for the electrical tape is it uses a dual opamp mounted on one 8 pin socket and the opamp has to be bent over to some degree make room and the tape is to insulate it from making contact with the case.

Johnny at Alchemy Audio thinks the opamp socket is not properly seated. I've taken it apart twice a push on the opamp toward the socket to push it down as far as it would go. After the second time of trying it worked briefly without ghost notes but the next time the ghost notes were back. He has told me to mail it back to him and let him have a look at it. I keep thinking I can fix it--but so far no good. I'm considering sending it back to him. Platefire

I would send it back.  If a socket is loose, it likely needs replaced.  If there is a weak solder joint on the opamp socket I would prefer them to replace it.  I did not know it could be repaired as a warranty claim.  I would assume the original did not have sockets as most Boss pedals do not.

[jojokeo]

Yessir! The boutique pedal business thrives on using quality components and doing smaller quantities.  That is how most get started.  I have modded a couple that have improved as well.  I call it reverencing the bean counter mojo.

True that! 

*I think changing the OTA chip also helps a lot in a Dyna. Also, besides puckerin' and a snappin' err snappin' & poppin', one of the great characteristics of subtle use of compression playing live and recording gives a bit nicer clarity with chords & notes helping you be heard a bit better in the overall mix.

[Platefire]

I hear ya on subtle use. You can set it where the response is very similar to plugging direct in an amp without all the ducking and diving going on . I don't know for sure but think I may have crossed the threshold where I need a compressor on all the time. I've been running one full time several months now. When I try to turn it off it just don't feel or sound right and end up turning it back on. I do turn it off sometimes when I use my tremolo effect as it seems to stifle it a bit. Platefire

OK earnest, sorry for hijacking your thread! Did you ever find a Dyna Comp?   

[ernest]

I've been gigging with a used 40 dollar Dyna Comp for a couple months now.  Telecaster into a Dyna Comp _ variable tremelo _ Wah _ small stone phaser _ cheap Fab echo.  Playing mostly with the Comp and Echo on all the time into my Hoffman 5e3 or Magnatone 421.  It's helped a lot, makes the band sound tight.   I don't mind the bit of noise it makes.   I'm still curious what some of the higher dollar ones sound like.  Thanks

[Ed_Chambley]

I've been gigging with a used 40 dollar Dyna Comp for a couple months now.  Telecaster into a Dyna Comp _ variable tremelo _ Wah _ small stone phaser _ cheap Fab echo.  Playing mostly with the Comp and Echo on all the time into my Hoffman 5e3 or Magnatone 421.  It's helped a lot, makes the band sound tight.   I don't mind the bit of noise it makes.   I'm still curious what some of the higher dollar ones sound like.  Thanks

I have a bunch.  I have some studio rack units as well.  The best compressor for country tone, quiet and stackable witha buffer is the Wampler ego.  I use it in my large pedal board.  It is a typical "ross" circuit with some added features.  Being buffered it will seem bright when first placed in you pedal chain, but it is not.  Great pedal and if I were a gigging country player I would consider it a must have.

Studio compressors are different as they are not designed to "color" you sound.  I have an old Altec Tube unit for analog inputs.

The diamond optical is great if you want to gain some studio presence.  Works more as a true compressor whereas the ross circuit is more of a limiter.  Soft knee and will "pump" instead of squash.

I have a Barber Tone Press, the previous version, I am considering selling.  Check it out.  It is very well respected and has the "blend" pot.  PM me if you would like to buy it.  It is low noise and stacks better than the Keeley.  The new Keeley is over the top.  It is nice, but I wouldn't like it for live.  The 4 knob Keeley is great for this and IMO is the best, but it doesn't stack very with most overdrives.  That is a killer for me, but if you never use dirt boxes what it does is REALLY nice.

Stomp box compressors are really effects.  The should be use gently.  Let me know if you have a specific compressor you are interested in.  I am cure I have either owned it or tried it if it is not a brand new one.

Don't ignore cheap ones either.  Joyo makes one that is the dan armstrong circuit and it works great with single coils.

[Platefire]

We'll regarding my CS-3 that I was having problems ghost noting, I sent it back. He said he no longer does the Monte Allurns mod apparently due to issues. He now does his own mod which is described on his site. I've been playing on it a couple of months now since my last post. No ghost notes and it works good for my purposes.

The dyna works good for my tele but to me on humbucker guitars or maybe even a strat, I need a tone control. The compressor has seemed to have became a permanent part of my sound now because when I try turning it off occasionally and can't take it, and turn it back on. I'm still considering the Whampler Ego if I can overcome my tightwad ways and spring for it ;>/ Platefire