Dialing in a tube amp

[Willabe]

Anybody think this makes sense?   

https://www.google.com/amp/s/tonesmiths.wordpress.com/2013/03/28/the-secret-to-quickly-dial-in-a-tube-amplifier/amp/

[shooter]

It works for the author, other than that, probably not.  as a non player, on a new build, I set all the knobs to 5, then figit till I smile

[Willabe]

How could it work?   

He said not to plug in a cord. So if the amp is quite, no humm/buzz, how do you hear anything much but some high end hiss?

 

[Ed_Chambley]

Hoe could it work?  Just like he said.


Would I do it, no way.  I have a build I am not happy with because the the amp needs more punch and according to his method, this would never be considered.  I guess we all have methods that work for us, but if an amp doesn't respond well everywhere and at all the frequencies I am interested in, somewhere I have cut too much.


But Brad, we even got down to how caps sound.  Players/Builders are quite different from strictly techs.  I simply inject a signal smaller than a pup does.  The smallest I have ever measured was a fender start singe coil was 93 mV.  Well I use a bit more.  I will normally set my signal to 180 mV, sine and review each stages gain.  This is where I look at touch sensitivity.  A lot of times I have to be able to change resistor values or make the switchable and even use a pot sometimes.


I find an amp that is very touch sensitive with single coils becomes easy overloaded with even PAF's, but then I sort of what I want.  An amp that is clean with a light touch, but breaks up easily by digging in.


Just my 2¢.

[jjasilli]

I think it makes sense insofar as it gets the user to explore a variety of amp settings.  However I think it fails the stated purpose of quickly dialing in a setting. 

[Ed_Chambley]

I think it makes sense insofar as it gets the user to explore a variety of amp settings.  However I think it fails the stated purpose of quickly dialing in a setting.

Thanks, I misread the idea here.  The guy is talking about how set your amp, not build.


I agree, this can help familiarize one with how the controls interact.

[jjasilli]

I should add, 6-2-6 is the venerable, long-established way to quickly dial-in an amp, assuming an FMV tonestack:  Vol 6; Treble 6; Mid 2; Bass 6.  That's probably good enough; or tweak from there.  That's quick & effective.

[Willabe]

"1. Turn the amp on with nothing plugged into the input."

The input jack is shorted to ground. He says to dial everything in with the 1st preamp tubes grid grounded. 

How do you hear anything from a amp that is quite? Maybe on a very noisy amp?

4. Starting with the bass, slowly turn it up until you hear it ‘kick in’.

Hear what 'kick in'? There's nothing plugged in to the amp.             

 

[Ed_Chambley]

"1. Turn the amp on with nothing plugged into the input."

The input jack is shorted to ground. He says to dial everything in with the 1st preamp tubes grid grounded. 

How do you hear anything from a amp that is quite? Maybe on a very noisy amp?

I have a DC Filaments on a few amps.  Even a HiFi with DC filaments.  With nothing plugged in, I can still hear the presence of the amplification if I turn it up enough, but I am not sure if I can hear the frequencies change.  I am going to check later.


JJ's example of 6-2-6 is cool, especially if the volume is 6.  To me the key is simply use a Super Reverb.  Turn up to about 4.5, Treble to 4 and bass at 3.  Mid to taste and you are right on the edge of tonal nirvana.  Turning each knob one position more just makes it goober.

[Willabe]

I should add, 6-2-6 is the venerable, long-established way to quickly dial-in an amp, assuming an FMV tonestack:  Vol 6; Treble 6; Mid 2; Bass 6. 

Not that I've seen/heard it all, but I've never seen anyone set a Fender amp like that. 

Mid and bass settings are flipped. A Fender amps TS is already scooped, even with a stock Fender value mid pot on 10.     

[Ed_Chambley]

I should add, 6-2-6 is the venerable, long-established way to quickly dial-in an amp, assuming an FMV tonestack:  Vol 6; Treble 6; Mid 2; Bass 6. 

Not that I've seen/heard it all, but I've never seen anyone set a Fender amp like that. 

Mid and bass settings are flipped. A Fender amps TS is already scooped, even with a stock Fender value mid pot on 10.     

That 10K mid pot is not enough IMO for single coils.  When Using a Black Face Deluxe Reverb, I actually use a 50K mid pot cranked and very little treble and bass, sometimes none at all.  This on the bridge of a Telecaster with heavy strings makes a great Bakersfield tone.  And that is the differences.  What tone do you want?


To get that unusual broadcaster, Swamp ash Twaaaaaaaaaaaaaaang you got have something that will twang and twang is NOT treble.


On a Plexi with bridge Humbucker for a great rock tone, everything dimed works very well if running to 4 greenbacks.  Loud is good!

[jjasilli]

Google fender magic 6 rule.  I was pretty close from memory.  And quick too

[Ed_Chambley]

Google fender magic 6 rule.  I was pretty close from memory.  And quick too

Well I have never heard this, but I get it.  Has to be different in different Blackface designs tho.  Not quite sure a Princeton would be the same as a Deluxe Reverb, but I have a fairly good lineup of small to larger fenders, so I will check it out.

[jjasilli]

Yes.  Note that the topic in the article quoted is how to quickly dial-in tone.  The rather lengthy procedure quoted in the article is clearly not quick, though it may of other interest.  I accept the Magic 6 Rule for quick results.  "Quick" does not necessarily mean optimal tone; or the best tone for a particular purpose.  But it should be good enough so that your not left fiddling with an amp when the band starts playing.

[jjasilli]

@Willabe:  Rereading the article, you make good points.  E.g., my Champ is so quiet you don't know it's on, even with all controls dimed.  There is no noise floor to work with.  Even if there is a noise floor I see no reason to believe that optimizing the tone of the noise floor will optimize tone under signal conditions.  It does sound like 

[Willabe]

Yeah I just don't get it.   

[Tony Bones]

Now I know that the mud frequency is 249.5 Hz.

[jjasilli]

 

[brewdude]

I remember an interview with Steve Kimock which had him describing a similar method for dialing in an amp--setting the tone controls with out a signal being fed through the amp.  I have explored this technique and understand where he is coming from, but I think of this as a starting point, not the end.

[pompeiisneaks]

I seem to remember reading something once somewhere, and then another brilliant guitarist pretty much confirmed it.  The idea I've heard is to have the tone pots and any other 'tone shaping' pots to maximum.  They all subtract something from the circuit.  Then reduce anything that's too strong for your tastes.  The pro that epitomizes this is Brian May, he's always played his AC30's with everything dimed.  He even had Vox make some custom ones for him that have no pot but volume, and he always keeps that at max :P

~Phil